IRISH VALUATION ACTS. Report from the Select Committee, with Minutes of Evidence, brought up and read. House, by Mr. Dale, the gentleman appointed by the Chief Secretary to investigate the condition of the primary schools on behalf of the Government. Irish Members were determined, as far as Report to lie upon the Table and to primary education was concerned, that be printed. [No. 130.] NEW BILL. POOR LAW MEDICAL OFFICERS' (IRELAND) SUPERANNUATION BILL. To provide Superannuation for Poor Law Medical Officers in Ireland," presented by Mr. T. W. Russell; supported by Mr. Harrington and Dr. Thompson; to be read a second time upon Thursday, 28th April, and to be printed. [Bill 154.] SUPPLY (CIVIL SERVICES AND REVENUE Order for Committee read. Motion made, and Question proposed, "That Mr. Speaker do now leave the Chair." this system should not be allowed to go on without a serious protest. It might be asked how were they to bring about a reform of that system. His only answer to that question would be, by reforming the whole system. He wished to draw attention to the authority to which the education of the children of Ireland was committed. That authority was known as the National Board of Education. It consisted of twenty gentlemen, ten representing Catholics and ten Protestants. It was not necessary for him to go into the names of those gentlemen, because every person acquainted with the educational question in Ireland was familiar with their names. While he admitted that those gentlemen might be very good citizens, he wished to ask had they the confidence of the people of Ireland? Did they represent education in any manner or capacity? They were not an elected but a selected body. They were anti-Irish in their tendency, and if the education of the children who were to be the future manhood and womanhood of Ireland was to be placed upon a satisfactory footing the whole system of education would have to be changed, and all those gentlemen now sitting on that Board would have to be replaced by educationists who had a thorough grasp of the needs of education in Ireland. Primary education would have to be made such as would appeal to the people of Ireland, and under the rule of the present board that was absolutely impossible. Something would have to be done to make "We believe that no system of secondary, the schools more attractive to the childtechnical, or higher education can ever be suc- ren. The children would have to be cessful unless a thorough and sound foundation attracted to, instead of being repelled be laid in the primary schools, that the primary from, the schools as they were at the schools in this country are in most instances unsuitable for accomplishing this object, being present time. Unless this was done the defective in sanitation, equipment, staffing, Irish child would make very little heating, and accommodation, and in their general educational progress. They could not of the opinion that these defects must be escape the conditions of their day, remedied immediately if any real educational and they had to face the competition of the civilised world. How MR. NANNETTI (Dublin, College Green) moved, "That, in the opinion of this House, the system of primary eduin Ireland is fundamentally defective, and has proved injurious in its operation." He said it was clear that all the schools for primary education in Ireland were antiquated and inadequate, and complaints came from north, south, east, and west as to the deficiences of the system. At the recent conference, held at the Mansion House, of managers and teachers this question had the primary place, as the first resolution carried was as follows attractiveness and comfort. We are, therefore, advancement is to be looked for." 1 The statements in this Resolution had was it possible for the children of since been repeated, in an authoritative Ireland to do this if in their document laid upon the Table of this early days they were denied the to give the opinion of a Protestant headmaster who had made this statement advantages of good primary education? At the present time their schools were in such a state that they were absolutely prejudicial to the health and comfort of the children. SO With regard to the staffing of the schools they should be made efficient that the teachers would not have to face an impossible task. There were two classes of schools in Ireland, namely, the vested and the non-vested schools. The non-vested schools were each in the hands of a manager. He knew of an instance in a very poor district where the manager had been called upon to provide new equip: ment and materials, and the result was that the teacher had been deprived of his salary. Who were the sufferers? Why, the unfortunate children attending the school who, between the two, were the victims, for they would not get the opportunity of learning that for which the school was supposed to exist. The president of the Teachers' Congress, speaking on this point, said- "With the scanty appliances now available, it is extremely difficult for even the ablest teachers in most of our schools to produce excellent results. In too many instances, rather than allow his skill and energy to remain unproductive, the teacher, out of his limited income, has to supply the means of carrying on his work. It is a grave reproach to a system which allows this injustice to be perpetrated. It is impossible for them to give efficient teaching under present conditions." "The majority are extremely unsatisfactory and quite unsuitable for teaching purposes. In hundreds of cases, especially in rural districts, the floors are earthen, and the roofs so bad that the rain is freely admitted. There is no local aid as in England and Scotland for keeping the schoolhouses in repair, for heating and cleaning them, and for equipping them. All this responsibility devolves on the local manager who really cannot get funds for these purposes. In but most cases the managers do what they can, very frequently the burden of repairs, heating, equipping, etc., falls upon the teacher." In order to educate the children the teachers of Ireland were prepared to make these great monetary sacrifices. They had recently had the Report of Mr. Dale on the condition of the schools of Ireland which must be fresh in the minds intend to quote very much from that of many hon. Members, and he did not Report. He rather preferred to give the opinions of teachers who lived in Ireland and who were as much conversant with the defects and the conditions of the schools in Ireland as Mr. Dale. The evidence of the teachers proved that the National Board and the Government had allowed this state of things to go on for such a number of years that it was high time that something should be done to put a stop to it. Dr. Moran, speaking of the Belfast schools in the report for the year 1900, said "Out-offices, instead of being an advantage, are in some instances a dangerous source of disease and death." Mr. Hynes, writing of the Dublin schools in 1900, said— "There are a gcod many which are defective in one or more of the following essentials-space, lighting, ventilation." Mr. Ross (Newry District, 1900) said"The most common defects are badly chosen Those were the views of the president of the Teachers' Congress which showed that the teachers were fully alive to the importance of this question, and they called upon the Government to provide a remedy in order that they might discharge their duties in a proper manner. The hon. Member for South Antrim said last year sites, insufficiency or absence of playgrounds, that in his opinion the Chief Secretary and objectionable sanitary arrangements. In for Ireland ought to take up the question, seven instances, schools attended by children of the state of the national schools in of Loth sexes are without privies." Ireland because even in the North of Dr. Alexander (Cork District, 1899) Ireland the schools were not fit places for the children to be confined in; and he also complained of the bad ventilation of the schools, and said that more playgrounds ought to be provided. Such was the opinion of the representative of what they were led to believe was the prosper ous North. In the matter of education he was afraid the North suffered just as much as the South. He would also like Mr. Nannetti. said "The ventilation of the class rooms is often very imperfect. The great majority of schools Dr. Beatty (Newtownards District, 1899) said almost indecent, and with little doubt insanitary position of the out-offices. Their restricted "Another most serious defect arises from the use is sowing the seeds of disease in after life." At certain seasons of the year when work "The school-houses no doubt help the could be got in the fields teachers had work of disease. I can count up fourteen monitors who have retired through ill-health, the greatest possible difficulty in getting and have, I imagine, all since died. Two the children to attend school. A headyoung monitors employed in an overcrowded master wrote to him as followsschool have died within a year." Those were the views of the inspectors and he was sure they were worthy of credence. He wished to show the House how the Government or the National Board had failed to remedy this state of affairs. The last extract on this subject which he wished to quote was that of the president of the teachers, who, speaking at Belfast this month, said "Some of the most serious blots in connec tion with primary education in this country are undoubtedly the unsuitability of the majority of the school buildings, the wretched condition of the furniture, the lack of the necessary teaching appliances, and the general want of any regular provision for heating and sanitation." Would the Government disregard the views of these representative men who knew the requirements of education in Ireland? The Chief Secretary, in a debate which took place recently, threw a slight on the people of Ireland because of their want of education. The right hon. Gentleman was dealing with the question of technical education, and stated that, in consequence of the want of the necessary education, it was impossible to find men in Ireland qualified for that class of teaching. The obvious answer was contained in the reports he had read. Under the circumstances it was no wonder that children were disinclined to attend the schools in Ireland. In many instances they had to tramp long distances to school. When they got there they were wet and begrimed, and they were often in a famished condition. The schoolhouse was not such as was to be found in England, and it was hard to compel the child to go where the conditions were so uncomfortable. Would the Government permit that state of things to go on much longer? The staffing of the schools also required consideration. The Chief Secretary stated the other night that he would favourably consider the advisability of reducing the average number required to be in attendance, so that there might be a second teacher provided for those schools where the average number at present required could not be obtained. "At present one teacher only is allowed in schools with an average attendance of less than sixty. Even with an average of forty, actual attendance sometimes sixty or over, one teacher cannot give anything like effective instruction in seven standards-six and infants-at the same time. The time of the children is wasted, and, what is worse, they acquire the habit of wasting time. There should be a second teacher in every school with an average of forty or above." Surely this was not unreasonable, especially considering the diminishing population in many districts in Ireland. He hoped the Government would take note of this gentleman's suggestion. There was another substantial grievance in connection with the educational work in Ireland under the present system. That was in reference to the status and remuneration of the teachers. The average salary of all teachers, principals and assistants, was £80. The salaries of the 4,689 headmasters in Ireland weretwenty-three of these headmasters were paid under £56 a year, 2,751 of these headmasters (nearly 60 per cent.) were paid between £56 and £86 a year, 1,253 of these headmasters were paid between £87 and £116 a year, 420 of these headmasters were paid between £117 and £138 a year, 186 of these headmasters were paid between £139 and £174 a year, fifty-five of these headmasters were paid £175 or over. The salaries of the 3,565 headmistresses in Ireland were-five of these were paid under £44 a year, 2,286 of these were paid between £44 and £72 a year, 799 of these were paid between £73 and £96 a year, 278 of these were paid between £97 and £113 a year, 197 of these were paid £114 a year or over. the teachers in Irish national schools were fully qualified and certificated teachers. He wished to contrast these salaries with the remuneration given in England. In this country the average salary of headmasters was £148 17s.; the average salary of headmistresses £98 78. 10d.; the average salary of assistant masters £108 11s. 5d.; the average salary of assistant mistresses £78 133. 7d. Scotland the average salary of head masters was £175 2s. 9d.; the aver age salary of headmistresses was All In money which would relieve a large portion of our educational needs, and place our schools in a position something nearer towards equality with the primary schools of England and Scotland. You are all aware that the passing of the English Education Act gave an addition In accordance with established custom the of £1,400,000 to the primary schools of England. equivalents of £212,000 and £185,000 became available for Scotland and Ireland respectively. In Scotland the equivalent grant was at once although, as everyone acquainted with the applied to the purposes of primary education; conditions existing in both countries is well aware, the Scotch schools in respect to the staffing, and sanitation, were miles and miles buildings themselves, to equipment, heating, ahead of those of our own unfortunate land. But the crying needs of Irish education were ignored, and the Irish equivalent grant was diverted from its legitimate purpose on the plea that the money could not be usefully applied to the purposes of primary education." £85 14s.; the average salary of assistant | action of the Government in denying us the masters was £115 5s. 10d.; the average salary of assistant mistresses was £70 188. 8d. He appealed to the Chief Secretary to do something to improve the status of remuneration of teachers in Ireland. As an example of the way in which the Treasury dealt with teachers in Ireland, he would mention a matter which had come to his knowledge in respect of the teachers in model schools. About 1875, the Lords of the Treasury demanded that one-third of the school fees paid by the children attending model schools in Ireland should be handed over to them, and further stipulated with the Commissioners of Education that in case of a diminution in the amount of fees collected the Treasury portion should not fall below £2,000 per annum. At that time the fees collected in model schools amounted to over £7,000 a year, and the balance of £5,000 was divided among the teachers of the respective model schools in proportion to the amounts collected in each. Owing to the Education Act of 1892, which practically abolished school fees in Ireland, the fees in model schools became so reduced that now only the bare £2,000 could be collected, and the Treasury insisted on receiving the entire sum. As a consequence, the teachers in model schools got now not one penny of the fees paid by the public under the belief that they were contributing to the incomes of those who instructed their children. In this way a sum of £56,000 had been levied off Irish parents during the past twentyeight years. This was a tax imposed on the Irish people without their knowledge, and he was certain if the parents of the children attending these schools knew what became of the fees, they would forthwith refuse to pay them, feeling as they did that they were already so largely overtaxed. Speaking at Belfast a fortnight ago, the president of the teachers said "I unhesitatingly declare that the responsi bility for the serious defects in our educational system rests entirely on His Majesty's Government. It must be remembered that our system of primary education is a State system; and that everyone connected with the system is directly or indirectly appointed by the State; and, therefore, the duty is cast upon the latter of making adequate provision for the education of the children of Ireland. That duty is rendered still more imperative by the recent Mr. Nannetti. He hoped he had not wearied the House, but he had endeavoured to put his case in the best manner at his disposal. He felt deeply the want of education in Ireland. He knew that if their people were to progress and face the battle of life in competition with other nations they must have more and better education. They did not wish their people to be for ever hewers of wood and drawers of water; but to give them an opportunity, by means of education, to come to this country or go across the Atlantic and enter upon the struggle for existence on equal terms with their fellow citizens. MR. THOMAS O'DONNELL (Kerry, W.) said that his hon. friend who had moved the Motion now before the House had done so in an elaborate and detailed manner in which he did not intend to follow him. It was a matter of satisfaction that the Irish Party had got this opportunity of discussing the education question at so favourable a time as the present; and they should not be doing. what was just to, and wise for, their country if they did not descend into both the details and the policy of the Irish educational system. It had been said "Give me the education of the people of a country and I care not what its Government may be." His argument was "Give us the control of the education of our own people and they will be better off: and then our demand for the other will be stronger and assured of success." He "The education supplied by the National Education Board is gradually undermining the fabric of the Irish Roman Catholic vast Church!' The Archbishop did not care whether it was improving the condition of the Irish people. That was not in his mind. 'If What was in his mind was we cannot get the Irish children educated in our creed, we give up the only hope of winning the Irish people from Popery." Was it any wonder that the Irish people objected to a National Education existence of Board whose declared policy that was? But Archbishop Whately added— the did not know whether or not that argu- prevailed in the parochial, diocesan and ment would appeal to the right hon. charity schools. Archbishop Whately Gentleman opposite. He wished to deal in his diary wrote: with the question of education in Ireland from a broad, national, and progressive point of view; and to show that in the past seventy years, during which the so-called National Board of Education in Ireland had been in existence, no real progress had been made in education; that nothing had been done for the progress of the country; and that the time and money spent on the existing system had been practically wasted. What was the cause of all this? Were the Irish so incapable of benefiting from a properly devised and properly administered system of education? No one who knew the history of the Irish race and the progress which they had made in America and in the British Colonies, where they had a fair field, could say that the failure of the system of the National Education Board was due to the people themselves. Unprejudiced witnesses, including even Mr. Dale, had unanimously come to the conclusion that the failure was due at first to the manner in which Ireland was governed; and to the refusal to give the Irish people some right to control the education of their children. It was from that point of view that he wished to criticise the work of the National Board of Education. From 1537 to the present year the same undermining policy had been continually adopted in the treatment of education in Ireland the English Government had sacrificed education to the interest of sectarian strife and supremacy. The Irish Parliament in 1537 established parochial schools all over the country and insisted that the English tongue should be taught in them. An Act of Elizabeth established diocesan schools in every diocese under the direction of the Protestants in Ireland; and then there were the charity schools intended to bring up the poorest and most neglected Catholic children as Protestants. Then there were various societies engaged in the useless task of trying to make converts of Catholics to Protestantism. Those who knew what had been done since the National Education Board was established were perfectly well aware that the same policy had been continued in the national schools as had "I cannot venture openly to express this opinion.' The hope, that was, of using this means of winning the Irish people from Popery. He had not quoted these words from any idea of embittering controversy between Englishmen and Irishmen on this education question, but to show the necessity of endless vigilance in proving the futility of a policy which sacrificed real education to sectarian purposes. Ho claimed that while that policy was continued the existing educational system in Ireland could produce no good or fruitful results for the Irish people. The National Education Board had not only no true educational policy; it had an anti-national policy. In 1841, when the Board was established, four-fifths of the Irish people spoke the Irish language. One would have imagined that, as was done in Wales and in the Highlands of Scotland, and in every country in Europe, the language which the children lisped at their mothers' knees would have been the language used as the medium of education in the schools. But that was not the method of the National Education Board. Because it was the Irish language, and lest its use might foster in the young Irish children a love of their own country, and make them true citizens and loyal to their native land, it was banned; and the only educational system adopted for teaching the children was through the medium of an unknown tongue. Everyone must be aware that such a policy must inevitably have in future generations a most wretched |